PAC-10 GOES HAM
by Holly Anderson on Jun 3, 2010 4:09 PM EDT
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We're just going to get out of the way and let Chip Brown speak his piece here:
[T]he Pac-10, which has its meetings in San Francisco starting this weekend, is prepared to make a bold move and invite Texas, Texas A&M, Texas Tech, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State and Colorado to join its league, according to multiple sources close to the situation.
Left out would be Iowa State, Baylor, Kansas, Kansas State, Nebraska and Missouri.
Messages left with Pac-10 officials by Orangebloods.com on Thursday were not immediately returned.
The six teams from the Big 12 would be in an eight-team division with Arizona and Arizona State. The other eight-team division would consist of USC, UCLA, Cal, Stanford, Oregon, Oregon State, Washington and Washington State.
The thought is the Big 16 (or whatever they decide for the name) would start its own television network that could command premium subscriber dollars from cable providers on par with the Big Ten Network and pay out upwards of $20 million to each of the 16 schools in TV revenue.
Such a merger between the six Big 12 schools and the Pac-10 would build a conference with seven of the country's top 20 TV markets (Los Angeles, Dallas, San Francisco, Houston, Phoenix, Seattle and Sacramento).
Much, much more on this behind the Rival$ paywall. We would normally be treating this with our usual skeptical disdain, but it's a) weirdly specific, and b) Chip Brown, who is not generally given to foolishness. (We're still skeptical, mind, but not necessarily disdainful -- much like our reaction to the feasibility of bear cavalry, see.) When we know more, you'll know too. Until then: floor is open. Let your pies fly out.
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Good golly
I hope this explodes in the PAC-10’s face
Any particular reason,
or is it Chest-Thumpy Thursday already?
________________________________
I will give my shirt for Tennessee today.
by Holly Anderson on Jun 3, 2010 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm all for it...
I don’t want Texas anywhere near the SEC after seeing how they’ve treated the rest of the Big 12.
I’d definitely pay for a ticket to Texas@Stanford though.
They stole my move!
- Jim Delaney
by ESS EEE SEE Speed on Jun 3, 2010 4:22 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Delaney just opened the package with the ICE in it.
What’s his next move?
"Voetbal is pas totaal als je wint"- quote that my youth coach used to throw around, it's been co-opted by Nike, translated roughly it means "Football cannot be total without the win"
to do what exactly?
check out the music scene and do body shots with some coeds?
we can beat the drum all day but Texas ain’t coming to the SEC
My body is a temple
by Wallacewade04 on Jun 3, 2010 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Academics
Texas wants to be seen as an academics and research powerhouse. It’s not going to get there by cozying up to schools like Auburn and Mississippi State. The SEC has only two AAU schools (Florida and Vandy) whereas most of the Pac-10 is there.
Team Speed Kills
SBNation's SEC Blog
HA AKADEMIKS. HA. HA. HA. CHORTLE CHORTLE CHORTLE.
_________________
I'm Banana dammit!!!
by BurritoBrosShits on Jun 3, 2010 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Okay I'm with your argument and everything
but lets make sure to notice the gap between Vandy and Florida
I don’t like people attacking the SEC’s commitment to academics to the point where I’ll happily make a fool of myself on the internet defending the south’s honor
but the SEC has an image problem in that department that Texas doesn’t like
My body is a temple
by Wallacewade04 on Jun 3, 2010 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Not sure what you're saying
Florida is really, really hard to get into for Graduate school- certainly harder than Vandy for some programs (their NIMH program springs to mind)
"Voetbal is pas totaal als je wint"- quote that my youth coach used to throw around, it's been co-opted by Nike, translated roughly it means "Football cannot be total without the win"
Some SEC schools simply have different missions than Texas does. Texas wants to be a national player on the research and academics scene. Schools like Auburn and Mississippi State want to provide affordable college programs for the children of the taxpayers that fund them. It’s not that one is necessarily better than the other; they merely have different goals.
As long as they meet their goals honestly, who cares? I couldn’t tell you who went to which college among the people in my office, but there’s a lot of great workers who all didn’t go to AAU institutions.
Team Speed Kills
SBNation's SEC Blog
It should also be noted that some Big 12 (and SWC) schools had different missions than Texas.
STILL stopping every few minutes to realize "Whoa. The Saints won the Super Bowl."
True
If they were following this academic mission wouldn’t they end up in a conference with Cal, UCLA, A&M, Michigan, Kansas, Iowa State, Arizona, and IU?
Arizona?
"When the seagulls follow the trawler, it's because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea"
You learn something new every day.
"When the seagulls follow the trawler, it's because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea"
Just for quick reference, since we're throwing the AAU metric around a lot:
Pac-10: UO, UW, Furd, Cal, UCLA, USC, UA
Big 12: CU, ISU, MU, NU, KU, UT, TA&M
SEC: Vandy, UF
SuchABigTenIt’sEleven: Whole Damn Thing
ACC: GT, Maryland, UNC, Duke, UVa
Big East: Rutgers, Pitt, Cuse
Other DI-A: Rice, Tulane
STILL stopping every few minutes to realize "Whoa. The Saints won the Super Bowl."
Given the way that you spell “Leland Stanford Junior College” I’d have expected Cal to be first on the list for the Pac 10.
"When the seagulls follow the trawler, it's because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea"
I…what? I see the way I spelled the name. I see that I did not list Cal first. I fail to see why the two ought to be connected.
STILL stopping every few minutes to realize "Whoa. The Saints won the Super Bowl."
Oh sorry, I assumed that if you spelled it “Furd” you were an alumnus of the University of California.
"When the seagulls follow the trawler, it's because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea"
Yet they need to put up a concrete wall around their studnt section to keep them off the field.
/insert witty Arizona imigration law reference here
Maybe being an AAU school isn’t all it’s cracked up to be.
children aren't sent to Auburn
they’re court ordered to attend
My body is a temple
by Wallacewade04 on Jun 3, 2010 5:20 PM EDT up reply actions
well
if a piece of shit has a name you still have to capitalize the name
My body is a temple
by Wallacewade04 on Jun 3, 2010 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions
I refuse to use any term for a certain rival other than "f$u".
SEC rivals get capitalized depending on my mood.
by zzgator on Jun 3, 2010 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
You're really shoring up our academics cred there, slugger.
________________________________
I will give my shirt for Tennessee today.
by Holly Anderson on Jun 3, 2010 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Who are you talking about?
I don’t recognize it. Do you mean the school out west?
by Tanner B on Jun 3, 2010 10:57 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
And Bama's is one of them?
STILL stopping every few minutes to realize "Whoa. The Saints won the Super Bowl."
there's nothing decent about Iron Bowl
seriously
the most stressful – life running rivalry in sports
My body is a temple
by Wallacewade04 on Jun 3, 2010 5:36 PM EDT up reply actions
There may be some merit to this argument
but it is blown enormously out of proportion. Every advocate of this argument that I have seen displays a misunderstanding of how the grant process works, and even the research process in general. Most grants kickbacks for the schools are limited and cannot be shared. Without knowing the numbers I can’t say definitively that the argument is right or wrong, but I suspect that its merit, if true, is much smaller than folks are making it seem.
(I’m not saying you do, TSK, you seem to be just relaying the information)
The new year approaching, click in. Let’s facelift bar! Open the wardrobe is not yet found love after another the right clothes? So, also waiting for? Immediate action bar!
The theory is that the best way to get research funding is to be associated with other schools that get a lot of research funding. A rising tide lifts all boats and all that.
Team Speed Kills
SBNation's SEC Blog
same argument Big Ten guys make about us
SEC is the best because we win the perception war that we’re faster and better than every other conference – even though of course we have down years and lose bowl games we’re still the “best”
the perception is that we the “red necks” don’t care about academics as much as the schools from the north and they use these sources to prove it
My body is a temple
by Wallacewade04 on Jun 3, 2010 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Depends on the schools- but I think you're right about grants
Grant kickbacks are way more restrictive than people think. You’re lucky if the grant applies outside of the department or even the researcher in question (at some (most, from what I hear) research universities, adjuncts are expected to provide in excess of half their income through grants).The ACC has interschool collaboration that allows some grants to be spread across schools and researchers, but that could well be independent of conference affiliation.
"Voetbal is pas totaal als je wint"- quote that my youth coach used to throw around, it's been co-opted by Nike, translated roughly it means "Football cannot be total without the win"
In my grant seeking experience, that money is mine and you can take it away from me when I'm cold and dead,
"Voetbal is pas totaal als je wint"- quote that my youth coach used to throw around, it's been co-opted by Nike, translated roughly it means "Football cannot be total without the win"
And not only that
The amount of grant money out there absolutely dwarfs the athletics money, and it’s not even close. A 10% increase in Texas’ annual R&D budget amounts to $45-50 million. Try getting that from a bowl game.
Team Speed Kills
SBNation's SEC Blog
Exactly
How does the Texas=academic powerhouse argument justify being in a conference with Texas Tech and Arizona State. Why should academics even be relevant to athletics? Vanderbilt has a sterling reputation in academics and collects a nice check for being the lapdog of the conference. Being successful in one field doesn’t prevent success in another.
by Truffle Shuffle on Jun 3, 2010 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Thank you
that’s exactly what i’ve been saying. not that academics isn’t important, just that it’s not important to the athletic department
Academics improve reputation held by people who care about that stuff and revenue in terms of grants, athletics increase revenue in different forms and give schools exposure, which in turn increase the reputation held by the general public.
by Truffle Shuffle on Jun 3, 2010 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions
also
nothing says “we care about academics” like forming a super-conference ensuring maximum revenue, relevance, and expanding the world of college football into unprecedented territory.
by Truffle Shuffle on Jun 3, 2010 6:02 PM EDT up reply actions
If Texas was really concerned about academics like the Ivy league clearly is, they would follow their lead and ban things like conference tournaments that take athletes out of the classroom.
by Truffle Shuffle on Jun 3, 2010 6:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Take a look at the fuckwits on most Ivy League lacrosse and ice hockey teams and you’ll get a good sense of their willingness to be flexible on academic standards.
"When the seagulls follow the trawler, it's because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea"
Lacrosse fuckwit students have banking fuckwit fathers who are able to pay for entrance into Ivy league schools other than Dartmouth, and Dartmouth’s lacrosse team is the worst in the Ivy league.
I suspect that most of them had fathers who paid for tuition at Andover, Exeter, Lawrenceville, etc. You’ve got to get on the path early.
"When the seagulls follow the trawler, it's because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea"
Lawrenceville?
My Central Gwinnett Black Knights are playing Ivy League sports? Woot! They will absolutely own that place.
by GwinnettGamecock on Jun 4, 2010 12:03 AM EDT up reply actions
Not entirely the same thing, but I can understand the excitement.
"When the seagulls follow the trawler, it's because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea"
Now see, that's no good
Those guys will just keep thinking their BMOC because they are good at a sport only played by other spoiled snots.
I’m telling you, get the second string guys from CGHS football and the JV basketball team, spend a couple weeks on lacrosse drills, and let them loose.
I’d give the lacrosse culture of entitlement about two weeks. Of course, you’ll have to deal with the lacrosse “stars” migrating to an even more obscure sport, but they can’t hide forever.
Rinse, repeat. Remember when lacrosse players’ dads and uncles played soccer?
by GwinnettGamecock on Jun 5, 2010 2:11 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Remember when lacrosse players’ dads and uncles played soccer?
Rec’d for 100% excellence.
That 17-year-old Hokie sitting in the rafters in Greensboro didn't see any of this coming.
Like all things, it depends
One very direct way it could hurt would be by discouraging serious earners and grantees from taking a job there. Having any sort of relationship, academic or otherwise, with the heavy hitters in the Big Ten and Pac Ten improves your standing with potential employees. I would give my firstborn to work for a semester at Stanford’s post doc program (Institute for Advanced study, I think it’s called). Vandy? Not so much. SO there’s that. But the grant process is very individual and individual research driven,
"Voetbal is pas totaal als je wint"- quote that my youth coach used to throw around, it's been co-opted by Nike, translated roughly it means "Football cannot be total without the win"
Most academics I know
don’t even realize football is happening in the fall. they’re just really confused why everyone is on campus on a saturday
My boss (Every week) "WHY THE HELL IS THERE A CAR WITH FLAGS IN MY PARKING SPOT"
He’s foreign and old, so it’s ok
"Voetbal is pas totaal als je wint"- quote that my youth coach used to throw around, it's been co-opted by Nike, translated roughly it means "Football cannot be total without the win"
At Tennessee...
even the Pakistani math teachers talked about football.
That was always a little odd, because you got the impression they couldn’t name a player if their life depended on it.
I used to work with a UT grad who'd spent his first 40 years in India and had never seen football til he got here
Now he owns like 20 gas stations and loves Peyton Manning.
Longest Atlanta Falcons winning-seasons streak: 2008 - current
The Falcoholic · Blog · Twitter
Only AAU graduates
Academics are always number one.
by GwinnettGamecock on Jun 4, 2010 12:04 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
This expansion
would give the Pac-16 ten members of the AAU, which would be more than any other conference. The AAU schools account for somewhere around 60% of all research grants. This is not just about athletics for the Pac-10, they want to leverage it to get more research dollars. And there is collaboration among universities in research.
by ESS EEE SEE Speed on Jun 3, 2010 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Perhaps there should be distinct athletic and academic conference affiliations.
“We play Bama in football, but we beat the hell out of Cal in differential geometry.”
by zzgator on Jun 3, 2010 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
okay - that earned an audible laugh
My body is a temple
by Wallacewade04 on Jun 3, 2010 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Terry Tao for Heisman!
STILL stopping every few minutes to realize "Whoa. The Saints won the Super Bowl."
I drive by high schools in Texas all the time with things like “1995 State Champions – Computer Science”
by Truffle Shuffle on Jun 3, 2010 5:41 PM EDT up reply actions
That's like the big ten of nerd camps
TIPster all the way. ESS EEE SEE neuron speed!
by GwinnettGamecock on Jun 3, 2010 11:40 PM EDT up reply actions
ADVANCE, motherfuckers
/itsaprogramnotacamp
STILL stopping every few minutes to realize "Whoa. The Saints won the Super Bowl."
by AllSaintsDay on Jun 4, 2010 12:55 AM EDT up reply actions
You too?
Duke runs the Underground Railroad for nerds in this country.
by Cowboycane on Jun 4, 2010 7:48 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I'm much older than you...identified by Duke...
enriched by Johns Hopkins…not sure Duke had the camps waaaaay back then…or maybe I just wanted to go further away from home…can’t really remember anymore…much like I can’t remember calculus.
Possibly,
but I think the camps have overlapped for all but the first few years in the 70’s. I could be much older than you. If this was a GMAT question, we’d have to go with:
D: There is not enough information provided to determine the relationship between A and B
by GwinnettGamecock on Jun 10, 2010 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions
It's not like you get more money for having more AAU institutions in the conference
Research groups have been like family trees for me- my old boss worked at Yale, his boss was at Duke, and all our stuff is interlinked, so of course we collaborate, AAU or not. AAU membership means we get more money to do what we love, but doesn’t dictate whom we work with, at least in our case. We get stipulations and stuff in grants for outside consultants, and we consult with people we know. I’m actually one of the first students to wander outside the nest.
"Voetbal is pas totaal als je wint"- quote that my youth coach used to throw around, it's been co-opted by Nike, translated roughly it means "Football cannot be total without the win"
It’s not like you get more money for having more AAU institutions in the conference
Well, overall the conference gets more research grants with more AAU members, and that’s something the PAC-10 would like to tout in their marketing.
by ESS EEE SEE Speed on Jun 3, 2010 6:02 PM EDT up reply actions
I can see that, and I can agree to a certain extent
But it’s not going to change who I work with
"Voetbal is pas totaal als je wint"- quote that my youth coach used to throw around, it's been co-opted by Nike, translated roughly it means "Football cannot be total without the win"
Not to mention that Texas thought it was a big enough deal last time around to request admittance into the Pac-10 (seven AAU members) and the Big Ten (11 AAU members) before settling on joining the Big Eight (five AAU members). It never wanted to join the SEC (two AAU members).
I don’t fully understand it myself, but this is the story that history presents us with.
Team Speed Kills
SBNation's SEC Blog
Not according to Harvey Schiller
SEC Commish Schiller has spoken publicly numerous times about his conversations with Texas and DeLoss Dodds back when the SEC first began expansion talks. Dodds wanted in the SEC and was ready to pull the trigger until the aTm folks got wind of it and the state legislature interceded.
Maybe, but...
Everyone else who has commented on the matter has said that A&M wanted in the SEC and Texas didn’t.
Team Speed Kills
SBNation's SEC Blog
aTm wanted in, but
once the SEC found out they would have to take both Texas and aTm due to political influence, the SEC said no thanks and moved on.
The point is the talk of “Texas would never join the SEC” is rewritten history based on what took place back in 1989-ish. If they don’t want any part of the SEC now, that’s one thing. But that was not the case 21 years ago.
You're confusing correlation and causation here
Schools are in the AAU. Those schools make up a lot of research money. Therefore, the AAU is responsible for that.
Research money largely comes from extra-institution grants to individual professors (which don’t give a shit which school you’re at, let alone which conference). It also comes from intra-institution money, which also doesn’t give a shit what conference you’re affiliated with. Again, it goes to individual professors.
Professors may collaborate for any number of reasons; usually those reasons are
1) someone is working in the same field on a similar project, or
2) convenience (that professor might be right down the hall and a good friend, reducing expenses associated with collaborating outside of the university)
Neither of those has anything to do with conference membership.
I’ve yet to see an example of two institutions sharing research money obtained from either of the two above sources on the sole basis that those schools are in the same athletic conference. I have a parent who’s almost a 30 year faculty member at a BCS school and asked her about it and she’s never heard anything of that either.
Again, I think most of this confusion stems from a misunderstanding of where research money comes from, where it goes, and on what basis it’s allocated. If Big Integer schools want to demand research credentials from their schools, that is of course their prerogative. It has absolutely no relevance to undergraduate athletics, but when you’re struggling and in need of an image boost, sometimes far-fetched notions can seem very plausible.
The new year approaching, click in. Let’s facelift bar! Open the wardrobe is not yet found love after another the right clothes? So, also waiting for? Immediate action bar!
Adding 3 more AAU members to the conference is not about sharing research money, but the existing universities would rather be associated with another strong research university than one that isn’t because it enhances their own collective reputations and perhaps attracts more talented people there, who in turn attract more grants. The undergraduate football and basketball fans sometimes turn into PhD candidates, it’s true.
by ESS EEE SEE Speed on Jun 3, 2010 7:03 PM EDT up reply actions
I disagree
people choose their school based on fandom, true. but those kinda people don’t choose schools based on programs. sometimes your school has a good program and it’s wonderful for you (Ole Miss has an amazing Int’l Studies program, so I was very lucky…except for the being an Ole Miss fan part). Also, there’s the issue of undergrad vs grad school. undergrad is generally for partying, while advanced degrees are for getting down to business. I still argue that sports and academics are unrelated. You join a sports conference for sports excellence. You join an academic association of schools for academic excellent.
I went to Florida, and lots of people in my graduating class stayed there for grad school and a few even stayed for doctoral work. I was recruited to do so by a professor there, but I chose to do my grad work elsewhere, but lots of people stay on and continue studies. I had other reasons for attending Florida (legacy), so I didn’t even apply to the school out west, it just wasn’t somewhere I would have been comfortable. However, I don’t think there’s any doubt that athletics attracts people to a university, and some of those people are inevitably going to be pretty smart.
by ESS EEE SEE Speed on Jun 4, 2010 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions
I'm not disagreeing that some do that
but I think people choose programs in which they want to participate, not games they want to attend. Good grad programs attract good students/academics. If you build it, they will come…
Right....
Televen’s still got the upper hand there.
by ESS EEE SEE Speed on Jun 4, 2010 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions
You are right
Except for the bit about “giving them the most of any conference” – the Big Ten has Eleven AAU schools. FUCKING IRONY.
Actually 12
The University of Chicago is still a member in terms of academics (the CIC). Turns out we haven’t been able to count for a long time.
It never gets to be easy
by chitownhawkeye on Jun 3, 2010 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions
I think that also confounding this argument is that most people who enter into this argument have this mostly wrong idea that academics are mostly about a school’s undergraduates. They aren’t. Academics are about research, and if there are any students who are important in this measure of academics, it’s the graduate students.
STILL stopping every few minutes to realize "Whoa. The Saints won the Super Bowl."
Even this is an overstatement
“Academics” is a term so overbroad it is devoid of any real meaning.
Some schools are incredible undergrad institutions and utter non-players with regards to research. (See: every liberal arts college). The “academics” are good in the sense that you get a good education (or, to be more specific, your institution has a reputation for giving you one). It would be silly to say a Williams or an Amherst or a Davidson has “bad academics.”
There are also plenty of state universities that specialize in research and somewhat neglect undergraduate instruction. (See: some land grant schools, some SUNY schools).
So, you see, it’s silly to encompass two wholly different notions of academics under one umbrella term.
Stupid people, often pasty and from colder parts of the country, will attempt to use evidence of one as evidence as the other. Those attempts are amusing. E.g., “our graduate experimental neuropsychology department gets lots of ro1 grants SO OUR FOOTBALL PLAYERS ARE SMARTER THAN YOURS!!!!@!!!”
The new year approaching, click in. Let’s facelift bar! Open the wardrobe is not yet found love after another the right clothes? So, also waiting for? Immediate action bar!
I imagined this would have the results of throwing a grenade into a pile of gasoline cans
On your point, OS, I would say that in this case we’re talking more about “academics” in terms of the research side. Texas wants to be mentioned in the same sentence as the top private and public major research universities churning out the next cures for cancer, engineering marvels, etc.
That said, I also fall in the camp that believes Texas would join the SEC last because of the perceived weakness in academics. Now I know this argument has been thrown around a million times, and I’m probably not in the best place to argue about this (nor do I have a particular interest, being a fan and not an actual alum of an SEC school), but looking at the few objective ranks we have (US News, etc.), the SEC is unfortunately weaker top to bottom (excepting Vanderbilt) than everyone except the Big East and the Big 12.
What I find odd is that if the Pac 10 is so concerned about academics, why are they bringing in Texas Tech, Oklahoma State, and Oklahoma? All three schools would be on the lower end of the SEC. I’m not sure if I see Stanford and Cal really thrilled about bringing those schools on board. (This of course predicates that sheer avarice is not the main motivator for this, and we all know that it is).
I think we also had a long argument earlier about how much a school’s overall prestige affects its athletes, so I won’t go in that again.
by Cantabrigian_UGA_Fan on Jun 3, 2010 7:19 PM EDT up reply actions
They are inviting the other schools
to preserve natural rivalries. They won’t get the hotties to accept without inviting a few of their sorority sisters.
by ESS EEE SEE Speed on Jun 4, 2010 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions
I forgot about academics
That must be why Cal and Stanford are trying to get Texas Tech and the Oklahoma schools into the Pac-10. If academics mattered half as much as some self righteous Pac-10/Big Ten/Longhorn types claimed, everyone would be fighting over Rice. Academics are a convenient excuse in big time college athletics and nothing more. If Texas goes with the Pac-10, it will be because they think they will make more money there in the long run
by GwinnettGamecock on Jun 3, 2010 11:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Oklahoma is a fairly good school
The other two, well… I’m not going to argue there.
by ClarkusKentus on Jun 4, 2010 7:38 AM EDT up reply actions
Puhleeze...
We all know Texas is going to join the WAC after Boise State leaves, just because they could rule it with an iron fist.
Their first order of business will be to make Hawaii play Fresno State play a football game in brand new, Nike engineered “DeathPads”, which are designed to be comfortable and ergonomic, while inflicting fatal wounds with large spikes to the recipients of a hit.
I heard it from a friend’s cousin’s uncle’s former roommate, so you know it’s true.
by The Commenter Formerly Known as Not You on Jun 3, 2010 4:23 PM EDT reply actions
We need two red head bands to settle this
and a round table. Pac -10 on one Side Big 10 on one side
My body is a temple
The only reason I don't believe it
Is because it makes too much sense. Slive should be on a plane to Austin.
If you win all your fights, you're pickin em
You know who really benefits from all this?
If this produces a bidding war for the Texas schools between the SEC and Pac-10 (and who knows, maybe the Big 10?), look who’s now the most popular girl at the dance
The new year approaching, click in. Let’s facelift bar! Open the wardrobe is not yet found love after another the right clothes? So, also waiting for? Immediate action bar!
With a face like that he was always the most popular girl at the dance.
"Will Rogers never met Barry Switzer."
It's not Luke in Return of the Jedi
But, judging by that pic, I’d say that Mack has gone at least a third to the dark side. This deal is getting done.
by haveagreatday on Jun 3, 2010 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions
I'll believe it when I see it
Having lived in Pac-10 country my entire life, no other conference speaks out of both sides of their mouth than the Pac-10.
"Even the Swedes are getting mad."-Randy Hahn
"It's very cozy in the sin bin."-Randy Hahn
Never assume malice when incompetence is a more likely explanation.
"When the seagulls follow the trawler, it's because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea"
That's actually a really good maxim
It may soon become a signature of mine
The new year approaching, click in. Let’s facelift bar! Open the wardrobe is not yet found love after another the right clothes? So, also waiting for? Immediate action bar!
Did somebody say Tom Hansen?
CougCenter WSU's second main blog
by Craig Powers on Jun 4, 2010 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions
The PAC 10
would offer some seriously great trips for Road games if this were to happen…………………………………
………….I hate you Big Ten
This would guarantee...
ND to the Big 10.
Big 10 scoops Nebraska, Mizzou and ND (maybe add Rutgers and SU if they want 16).
SEC grabs FSU, Miami, Clemson and GT.
Oh, and Texas is never joining the SEC.
Maybe
USC really is getting the death penalty and they’re using Texas to hedge the loss.
(OK I don’t believe that for one red second but it it sure is a fun idea). What did we do for fun before the Internet Rumor season? I forget. But I bet it was dull.
Hmmmm
Pac Ten with theoretical television network and theoretical cash money or Big Ten with the real deal?
I mean, I wouldn't put it that way, because Australia is how you win the game.
"Voetbal is pas totaal als je wint"- quote that my youth coach used to throw around, it's been co-opted by Nike, translated roughly it means "Football cannot be total without the win"
well not in terms of game play..
I was thinking like this..
pretty sure the scale is spot on..
by bambakophobia on Jun 3, 2010 4:52 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
Well according to this
it makes much more sense, culturally and geographically, for UT and A&M to join the SEC than the Pac 10
Yeah, but there’s already an established connection between the Pac 10 and Texas… see? It’s right there on the map. (I assume that largest chunk of the Big 12 would be Texas.)
still hard for me to believe Junction Boys was filmed in Madagascar but.. maps don’t lie.
by bambakophobia on Jun 3, 2010 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Australia is the key to dominating Risk. The ACC new that 7 years ago when they waged war on the Big East.
by collegegameballs on Jun 3, 2010 6:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Australia is easily defensible but it’s a tough place to launch offensives from (only place to attack into is the Asian clusterfuck). North America’s a little harder to hold but much stronger for attacking; you can run over South America quickly without increasing your border length. In small games (3-4 players) I’ve found that to work better most of the time than holding Australia.
I was so bad at Risk
Basically my friends and I would save cards and build up these massive armies, expand so deep into enemy territory that we’d have one or two guys in each area, and then have the same repeated against us, and so on, etc. We weren’t exactly Napoleons here.
by Cantabrigian_UGA_Fan on Jun 3, 2010 8:57 PM EDT up reply actions
I won my first game with Australia
after other guys started trying the same strategy, I preferred South America. I would generally try to hold Central America to prevent a North American hegemony, keep on eye on the Asian lobster pot, and expand through Africa.
Risk strategies and academic camps in the same college football thread. This is just like the Rivals board.
by GwinnettGamecock on Jun 3, 2010 11:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Actually at higher levels of play the key to the game is the well timed backstab
The geography of the map is somewhat less important.
Agree the backstab is integral as well. But it is a lot easier to pull off if you fortify Australia early in the game, look as if you’re Mr. Neutral with your +2 armies a turn while everyone else is trying to battling for a continent.
Other keys to the game are convincing people it is in their best interest to attack everyone but you and never appearing to be the strongest.
by collegegameballs on Jun 4, 2010 9:04 AM EDT up reply actions
I'd flip the Pac-10 and Big 12.
So, to extend the scenario, the Pac-10 is just invading South America.
Alternatively, you can flip the SEC and Pac-10, since Asia/Europe/Africa is always a glorious clusterfuck until the end game anyway.
Simulated Gameday Experience - just like the real thing, only we have smoke machines.
by Chris Pendley on Jun 3, 2010 7:47 PM EDT up reply actions
no SEC flipping
I feel as though Asia perfectly represents the SEC..
lets just compare People’s Republic of China (PRC) and the SEC:
PRC – crazy influx of funds due to cheap labor and results leading to ridiculous things like.. entire cities that are empty
SEC – crazy influx of funds due to cheap labor and results leading to ridiculous things like Lane Kiffin
by bambakophobia on Jun 3, 2010 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Which works until you look at where Lane Kiffin is now.
Unless you’re going to make the argument that US buys shitty off-brand Chinese products.
Simulated Gameday Experience - just like the real thing, only we have smoke machines.
by Chris Pendley on Jun 4, 2010 6:53 PM EDT up reply actions
This is simple
The Big 12 is toast. It is toast because the grass is greener outside of the Big 12 for ALL 12 SCHOOLS. It will be the cookie that crumbles and everyone wants Texas.
If Texas sits idly by, they end up with a Bible Belt conference replacing Colorado, Missou, and Nebraska with Houston, SMU, and TCU. It all comes down to Texas’s options and how they feel about the drawbacks of each:
SEC: academics
Pac 10: Time zone, big issue with TV
Big Ten: Cold, geography, ditching their rivals – but boucoup academic/research $$ which every football fan seems to forget is more of the driver here.
Iowa State, Kansas State and Baylor sobbed into their beers
when they read your comment.
If the Big 12 goes away, those schools become mid-majors. Helloooo C-USA!
unless
the big east implodes and then Kansas, Kansas st, Baylor, and Memphis join the Big-10’s rejects to form a super basketball conference. If the entire Western USA can be classified in the PAC-10, then obviously geography is no longer a factor.
by Truffle Shuffle on Jun 3, 2010 11:17 PM EDT up reply actions
If/When the Pac-16 doesn't work
I expect to see the Texas and Oklahoma schools break off into a new conference. Expect them to look closely at Baylor, Kansas, Kansas State, Nebraska, Missouri, Iowa State, and Colorado joining them to form a conference big enough to have a championship game.
Team Speed Kills
SBNation's SEC Blog
by Year2 on Jun 3, 2010 4:47 PM EDT reply actions 4 recs
LOL That would be cool.
They could have the CCG in Texas every fuckin year too. /rolls eyes
I'm your huckleberry.
We learned in the formation of the Big 12 that the Pac-10 is then also inviting Baylor.
Also, this is gonna blow up.
STILL stopping every few minutes to realize "Whoa. The Saints won the Super Bowl."
New Governor in office
and this won’t go to bat to save the Bears. As an Aggie, he will probably be relieved to get that stumbling block off his schedule.
Awesome awesome awesome idea
Something some of you might not realize: we have a new commissioner in the Pac-10.
Something else you might not realize: this is a deal that is VERY LIKELY to be approved by the conference presidents. Yes, they like academics, and there’s academic deadweight there (Oklahoma schools) – buth there’s also Texas and Colorado.
Something non-Pac-10 people might not realize is that this alignment would allow us to keep the old Pac-8 (which is the real traditional Pacific Coast Conference of yore) intact. It also gives us a league which pretty much destroys the MWC and the WAC in the Mountain Time Zone.
If Texas A&M does not want to join, fine. Remove them and add Utah. Now the MWC is really dead.
The time zone issue isn’t that great if you have an eastern division which plays largely in the Mountain and Central time zones. All the old Pac-8 plays in the Pacific time zone.
Championship game can be in Denver or Phoenix. Everyone wins!
I learned about this on a UW blog, and we all agreed that this is the right move. If Ducks and Huskies can agree on this – look out.
Signed, SEC
_________________
I'm Banana dammit!!!
by BurritoBrosShits on Jun 3, 2010 5:07 PM EDT reply actions
err...
Didn’t the Texas Gov and Legislature step in the last time someone tried to move to a conference and leave out Baylor? Just sayin’
Reports of the current situation seem to indicate that Baylor doesn’t have the clout today that it did back then.
Team Speed Kills
SBNation's SEC Blog
No clout maybe,
but certain student-athletes do still possess a mean right cross.
by HoodRiverDuck on Jun 3, 2010 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions
She’s dead, after all.
"When the seagulls follow the trawler, it's because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea"
HAVE SOME RESPECT FOR MIZ ANN RICHARDS, SIR.
________________________________
I will give my shirt for Tennessee today.
by Holly Anderson on Jun 3, 2010 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions
I have plenty of respect for Ann Richards, but I don’t see why that should get in the way of making an inappropriate joke.
"When the seagulls follow the trawler, it's because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea"
by DC Trojan on Jun 3, 2010 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
the late Gov. Ann Richards was a big force in shoehorning Baylor into the Big 12
The Pac 16 will have one team of Bears, and only one*. That lead-in photo that Holly Anderson posted at the top of the blog is not Baylor vs Cal.
- Bruins are rip-off Bears and don’t count.
by ginfizzbear on Jun 3, 2010 5:20 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
rec'd
for sheer … I don’t know what, exactly.
________________________________
I will give my shirt for Tennessee today.
by Holly Anderson on Jun 3, 2010 7:34 PM EDT up reply actions
or as the French say, j'ne sais quoi
But I understand why you used English in your rec, since technically, there is no French in college football.
(aside: DUDE! a rec from Holly herself on my very first EDSBS post. Like a kid called up from the minors who gets a single on his first at-bat, I am batting 1.000. Delightful, but an unsustainable average. Anyway, acceptance speech: You like me. You really, really like me.)
I'm fully expecting to see "Team PAC-10" and "Team BIG-10" on every truck in Texas
It's not what you've done but what you are doing that matters.
And the roses in this grand ol' stadium are once again Crimson. - Eli Gold, CTSN Broadcast of the BCS Championship Game at the Rose Bowl, 1-7-2010
what if
UT goes to PAC-10 and A&M goes to the Big-10 and then the state legislature of Texas can put tax funds towards A&M and develop an All-TEXAS national championship. The amount of clout and revenue would be astronomical.
by Truffle Shuffle on Jun 3, 2010 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Funny, if you read further it has aTm contemplating a move to the SEC without Texas.
I know I’d rather them go to the Big-Interger instead of the SEC. Fran isn’t there anymore. Guess the Aggies didn’t hold the rope.
It's not what you've done but what you are doing that matters.
And the roses in this grand ol' stadium are once again Crimson. - Eli Gold, CTSN Broadcast of the BCS Championship Game at the Rose Bowl, 1-7-2010
by AlabamaJammer on Jun 3, 2010 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Low blow
Look, I understand a lot of us had reason to get pretty hammered out in Pasadena, but I seriousyl don’t think any of us were wasted enough to drop Twilight references.
Unfortunately I did because of what I saw today on a car...
…and quickly learned the evils of the internet. I just wish I could un-learn what I learned.
It's not what you've done but what you are doing that matters.
And the roses in this grand ol' stadium are once again Crimson. - Eli Gold, CTSN Broadcast of the BCS Championship Game at the Rose Bowl, 1-7-2010
by AlabamaJammer on Jun 3, 2010 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions
That was awesome
I would purchase both of those and place on opposite sides of my Mac decal and underneath my Borg Institute of Technology decal.
Sancto Tedford
by Anonymous IV at Mono Lake on Jun 3, 2010 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Mac decal? I don’t think I know you anymore.
Who are you, anyway, Mr. “Anonymous”?
STILL stopping every few minutes to realize "Whoa. The Saints won the Super Bowl."
Oh here we go. Is this going to be a “tyranny of Steve Jobs” thread or open source?
"When the seagulls follow the trawler, it's because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea"
Macs are fine. People who put Mac decals on their cars are not.
STILL stopping every few minutes to realize "Whoa. The Saints won the Super Bowl."
dodged a bullet there.
"When the seagulls follow the trawler, it's because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea"
I’m currently using a Mac in my office. At home are a Linux desktop and a Windows laptop. None of the three is anywhere near being clearly an objectively better OS.
STILL stopping every few minutes to realize "Whoa. The Saints won the Super Bowl."
I’m inclined to agree – on the basis of Windows laptop (work), OS X desktop (house), and linux laptop (desperate attempt to extent the functional lifespan of an ancient Windows laptop).
"When the seagulls follow the trawler, it's because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea"
I use Windows at work
and an three year old MacBook Pro with a a partitioned hard drive to switch between OS X and Windows. It all just depends on what you are doing.
Sancto Tedford
by Anonymous IV at Mono Lake on Jun 4, 2010 10:40 AM EDT up reply actions
OOF!
/grabs chest
//slumps over
///raises fist, shakes in defiance, extends middle finger
////collapses
FIN.
"...when the devil says to you: do not drink, answer him: I will drink, and right freely, just because you tell me not to."
— Martin Luther
Is that a cardiac arrest
or just a bad esophagus?
Sancto Tedford
by Anonymous IV at Mono Lake on Jun 4, 2010 10:37 AM EDT up reply actions
Who am I?
Just your average former migrant farm worker, current PhD. student, librarian, and musician.
Sancto Tedford
by Anonymous IV at Mono Lake on Jun 4, 2010 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions
If you're looking at the trucks,
expect a lot of “Team SEC”.
by GwinnettGamecock on Jun 3, 2010 11:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Question
If the Big XII/Pac 10 realignment is the movie “Vacation,” and The Big XII South is the Griswolds, does that make Baylor Aunt Edna?
...and Baylor cousin Eddie?
It's not what you've done but what you are doing that matters.
And the roses in this grand ol' stadium are once again Crimson. - Eli Gold, CTSN Broadcast of the BCS Championship Game at the Rose Bowl, 1-7-2010
by AlabamaJammer on Jun 3, 2010 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions
derp
I meant A&M when I typed Baylor. DAMN YOU EYES!
It's not what you've done but what you are doing that matters.
And the roses in this grand ol' stadium are once again Crimson. - Eli Gold, CTSN Broadcast of the BCS Championship Game at the Rose Bowl, 1-7-2010
by AlabamaJammer on Jun 3, 2010 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Silly
Kansas State is cousin Eddie.
"...when the devil says to you: do not drink, answer him: I will drink, and right freely, just because you tell me not to."
— Martin Luther
The level of my incredulity at this proposal...
… is matched only by the vigor of my DWM.
"Smokey, this be not the foul jungles of the darkest East Orient. This be ninepins. We are bound by laws."
This is the college football equivalent of Lebron-watch.
_________________
I'm Banana dammit!!!
by BurritoBrosShits on Jun 3, 2010 7:02 PM EDT reply actions
not to be outdone
Iowa state is the german couple that has no idea what’s going on when the griswolds (big 12 opponents) leave
by alex henery's foot on Jun 3, 2010 7:16 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Colorado = Todd and Margo
the dipshitty new age couple who wind up with all the collateral damage from Clark’s crazy schemes.
"...when the devil says to you: do not drink, answer him: I will drink, and right freely, just because you tell me not to."
— Martin Luther
Yeah, I dunno...
Just because it was specific is meaningless. The report from the KC radio station was quite specific as well. Also, way too much info disconnectedness than normal. Has the scoop on the Big XII 6 AND Nebraska getting no love from the Big Ten? That is kind of alot for one beat writer.
Until I see more, I refuse to be a sucker. Woman and children can be careless, not men. Especially men like me who are currently in their underwear while typing this.
Arizona, ASU & Colorado football
all strapped to the conveyor belt, headed nut-first into band-saw.
Cut off from SoCal and playing in a 3-team version of BigXII north. The money must be unimaginable for them to cut off their own arms.
If the all-must-agree rule is true...
…there must be something in this for Arizona and Arizona State that I don’t get. Because they’ll see a lot more of the state of Texas than they will of California in a 16-team conference.
That 17-year-old Hokie sitting in the rafters in Greensboro didn't see any of this coming.
Just in case anyone missed the update
CU AD Mike Bohn is saying he’s been led to believe that the invites will happen
STILL stopping every few minutes to realize "Whoa. The Saints won the Super Bowl."
It seems to be another wait and see what happens deal.
Well, it did make the end of the work day a bit more exciting.
Sancto Tedford
by Anonymous IV at Mono Lake on Jun 3, 2010 10:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Someone may have mentioned it already
But all TEN of the Pac Ten presidents have to agree on a team for them to be admitted to the conference. No offense to KSU, Okie and Okie St, but would Standford and Cal’s presidents vote to admit those schools? I read that Stanford is still pissed about admitting Arizona State in the 70’s.
I would doubt that all six would accept, or even if they did would be admitted
I know that the Pac 10 is the “vanguard” for a nationwide revolution, but they’re not really picking 12 teams, right? I think they’re just hedging their bets in case Texas isn’t wooed.
by Cantabrigian_UGA_Fan on Jun 3, 2010 10:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Cal, yes; the Furd, probably
Cal’s Chancellor (Robert Birgeneau) has already told some alums at a dinner that he’d be “surprised if something did not happen that revolutionized college athletics” with the Pac-10 realign.
It's all about academics
as I have heard from multiple Texas alums, Pac-10 boosters, and Jim Delaney.
Expect the SEC to target Duke, Wake, Emory, and University of the South.
by GwinnettGamecock on Jun 3, 2010 11:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Tulane an in-conference rival again?
STILL stopping every few minutes to realize "Whoa. The Saints won the Super Bowl."
by AllSaintsDay on Jun 4, 2010 12:58 AM EDT up reply actions
It's all about numbers
University of Phoenix online is next!
It never gets to be easy
by chitownhawkeye on Jun 4, 2010 8:29 AM EDT up reply actions
The beauty of this
Is that the deal is big enough to be flexible.
Oklahoma or Texas A&M don’t want to jump to the BigPac?
- Fine, add Utah (or Kansas or Missouri) and Nebraska instead. Hell, if there isn’t significant political pressure, take Kansas INSTEAD of Texas Tech. Much better fit. Leaving Utah on the board adds the SLC market and gives the new eastern division a dominant position in the MWC’s “turf,” as it would contain four of the five biggest athletic departments in the Mountain time zone.
Any of those schools is a better academic fit for the Pac-10 anyway – at least Oklahoma and Okie State, and probably Texas A&M as well.
The only “indispensable” partner is Texas. Everything else can be negotiated.
nothing gets this place going faster than an assertion that something associated with the south is not the best ever.
pride’s a sin, yo.
Um, what?
That really isn’t what spurred this thread.
STILL stopping every few minutes to realize "Whoa. The Saints won the Super Bowl."
LMAO @ AustinAg
Congratulations on getting into the AAU, what, eight years ago?
Texas was there in 1920. Even Oregon’s been there for 40 years.
Dude brings the funny though. Strongest academics in the Big XII “except Texas, and there its closer to a push.”
O Rly?
A&M is Texas’ fag hag.
If it weren’t for UT and the state giving A&M a chunk of the Permanent University Fund, the Aggies would still be a bunch of homoerotic weirdos in overalls playing army men and chasing cheerleaders off their football field with drawn swords.
Mind you, I would love it if A&M joined us in the Pac-10. Think Stanford Band. Think away games at Berkeley, Seattle, and Eugene.
Lots of ag schools have big research budgets. The Pac-10’s ag schools are Wazzu and Oregon State. Neither is the standard bearer for the conference in any sense of the term. The Pac-10 isn’t really an ag school conference. Hence, what I said about better academic fit. Nobody cares how many research dollars the Aggies get to grow maroon carrots or breed sexier sheep (oh wait, that was Oregon State). Hell, A&M’s forte is supposed to be engineering but they can’t even do Lincoln Logs correctly. Jenga?
Someone is going to show the Pac-10 presidents video of “Squeeze Ag” and that will put the kibosh on conference expansion once and for all.
Besides, what really matters is football and A&M has only ever succeeded way way back when (think John David Crow and the Bear) or by good ol’ fashioned cheatin’ (think Jackie Sherrill and, less brazenly, R.C. Slocum, whose ghost is still picking up his laundry off the practice field in College Station).
Most importantly, I assume that AustinAg graduated from A&M, and now lives in Austin. Kind of speaks for itself, really.
TV + Conference Expansion + cold medicine = Captain Trips.
Does this remind anyone else of the Stand? I can’t decide if Jim Delaney is Randall Flagg or Mother Abigail.
Some things are so crazy you don't believe they're for real until they're officially announced...
… but this is crazier than that. I won’t believe it’s real until they actually start playing games.
Regarding Those
One of the party lines regarding SEC schools is that they have a different mission (i.e., our high schools are so bad that the colleges have lower standards). I think UGA and Florida are at the front of the public schools in terms of trying to build up stature, and if I recall both are ranked 50 and 60 in the US News reports. I think I’ve mentioned before that I don’t really mind the whole “SEC iz dumb rednecks lolz” argument since I don’t hold an SEC degree, but I think it’s fair to say that even in the “Big Little Ivy League”, there are enough dumbs to balance out the slightly higher SAT 75 percentiles.
by Cantabrigian_UGA_Fan on Jun 4, 2010 9:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Realize, as has been mentioned by others, that this doesn’t matter to Texas. When they say “academics,” they don’t care about snobby admissions departments. They don’t give jack shit about anything involving undergrads who aren’t at UT.
What they want is to be associated with other schools that get lots of research grants.
STILL stopping every few minutes to realize "Whoa. The Saints won the Super Bowl."
Aren't we all forgetting the current governor of Texas is a former A&M yell leader?
It's not what you've done but what you are doing that matters.
And the roses in this grand ol' stadium are once again Crimson. - Eli Gold, CTSN Broadcast of the BCS Championship Game at the Rose Bowl, 1-7-2010
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